Fractal Memory stored in genes? Intelligent Design or ........

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Comments on this article:

» left by David Tanguay (2 years 104 days ago.)

I’ll check out the link you’ve left here later however I am not a believer in Darwin’s theory of biological evolution. That is I do not believe we have evolved from some form of animal life. I do believe we have evolved from an unfolding process of change mainly through the process of trial and error. However I do believe our seed is reborn into our offspring in an evolved manner.

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» left by Leah ^(12,697)
Leah (2 years 104 days ago.)
Isn't it curious David that humans desire improvement on both a conscious (self and personal improvement) and on an a genetic biological level. Perhaps the genes drive both those. Afterall personal strength is a much a survival necessity as is physical etc.
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» left by Leah ^(12,697)
Leah (2 years 104 days ago.)

Meanwhile I've never felt that 'natural selection' was an adequate explanation for how species change and certainly not one that adequately explains the massive variety and speciality of species regarding diet,environment etc.

I am also a believer in intelligent design. In our future we will create a world and species to observe and manipulate. We will be their God. What's so unlikely about the possibility that it has already been done, and we're it! Some spotty 14yr olds science project perhaps ;)

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» left by James Carrick ⁽⁷²⁾ (2 years 101 days ago.)

CB, I will comment but I'm not a member of the scientific community. (Smile) I too believe in intelligent design. Your article was informative and interesting. Fractal memory makes sense. It is a way for the species to "remember" how it got to where it is. Does that make sense? Anyway, I understand what you're saying even if I can't clearly put it in writing! (Laughing) I enjoy your writing!
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» left by Leah ^(12,697)
Leah (2 years 101 days ago.)
Thanks, I too have trouble putting it into writing! What is interesting is that I have posted this article on a couple of science sites and they have not recieved a single response on either. Now usually if you post something ludicrous or what they call psuedoscience, they hop all over you and tear you to shreds. So I am thinking that their lack of response is indicative of them having a ponder and not being too sure about it. I had a reply on myspace though which agreed with the possibility of fractal memory in terms of 'design' over the generations but not with regard to 'event's'. The reason I think events are included is due to stories of memories that seem to arise in people who have had organ transplants. Without knowledge of the donor they take on the characteristics and 'tastes' of the donor. An all round fascinating topic.

thanks for your reply :)
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» left by Alltruism (1 year 211 days ago.)

In response to your comments on Intelligent Design and us being a 14 year old's science project, that could well be the case and would explain the existence of adaptive complexity (such as life) here in our universe..however, it would leave the existence of adaptive complexity in that 14 year old's universe. As a result, Intelligent Design doesn't have the explanatory power we need - it leads to infinite regress. So far, evolution through natural selection is the ONLY plausible way to explain the existence of adaptive complexity - even if our universe is a creation of an intelligent designer, that designer, or that designer's designer (and so on) must have been the end result of a process of evolution from simple beginnings. Evolution remains the only way to explain adaptive complexity without simply postulating the existence of adaptive complexity (such as an intelligent designer), which of course offers no explanation at all!
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» left by Leah ^(12,697)
Leah (1 year 210 days ago.)
I agree with what you say, this article is about our origin rather THE origin of the very first anything.

Science cannot explain our origin as there are missing pieces but that does not mean that the evolutionary origin of other possible 'alien' species cannot be explained or understood. If this planet were terraformed, it would mean when understanding our origin we'd have to understand the terraforming process. If the alien species did indeed 'evolve' naturally then they may have a more easily identified life creating process which could be replicated experimentally, which possibly was recreated experimentally - hence 'us'.

This is just a random thought not a belief by the way!

If that makes sense?
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» left by Alltruism (1 year 211 days ago.)

In response to your interesting discussion of fractal memory: It is a fact that genes contain information that determines behavioural traits, these traits being selected by natural selection just like other, more obvious, gene effects (like size, length of claws etc). Genes that cause certain types of behaviour that turns out to be advantageous to the organism are likely to be passed into the next generation (as the organism is more likely to survive and reproduce due to its superior behavioural "programming"). The analogy of evolution being just a software update is false, as evolution has shaped the hardware and software together, with changes in both being genetically controlled and heritable.

However, the fact that large quantities of digital information is stored in genes has nothing to do with the storage of memories as commonly understood - the memories we lay down during our lives are stored in the brain and since they are not stored in our genetic code, these memories are not heritable - they are not passed on.

Thus using the term memory for both the "things we remember" and the heritable behavioural programming of our genes can lead to misunderstandings.

As our memories (in the common sense of the term) are not stored in our genes, they are not passed on to our children, and are not present in the rest of our bodies beyond the brain. Genetic "memory" has no relevance to "past life memories" or "transplant memories", as it is a fundamentally different type of memory - genetic memory relates to instinctive behaviours, not to "learned" memories such as we lay down in our brains during our lives.
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» left by Leah ^(12,697)
Leah (1 year 210 days ago.)
I think it is possible that 'relevant to survival' memories are stored and passed genetically via reproduction, hence adaptation, which I don't believe is all down to natural selection.

It is just the case that this type of memory is one we cannot access consciously, so yes in that regard it is a very different type of memory I am describing.

With regard to people who have had limb transplants taking on the original owners personality traits. If those traits are ones that would be passed through the genes via reproduction (we know we often inherit character traits from our family regardless of what science says in that regard look at identical twins seperated at birth and some of their similarities) so if those traits are heritable then they are stored some where some how as memory and as the brain is not formed at conception, the only palce the memory can be transferred and stored is in the genes.
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» left by Ben Morrish ^(7,936)
Ben Morrish (1 year 209 days ago.)

There is no evidence that memories laid down in life are somehow added to (stored in) our genetic code.

If it was true that our genetic code was altered during our lives to store memories gained during our life then this would be observable in studies. Studies of our genetic code have been done and have shown that there is no such change in our genetic code.

I'm not sure why you say that we often inherit character traits from our family "regardless of what science says in that regard" - science agrees completely on that! Some character traits are passed down genetically, and some are passed down through upbringing.

Behavioural tendencies and character traits (which are not the same thing as memories laid down during your lifetime) can be stored in genes just like other qualities (physical size, eye colour etc), but the vitally important point to note is that information is not added to an individual's genome during their lifetime and then passed on to the next generation. Your genome when you die will be the same as it was when you were born.

Additionally, for what you are saying to be correct, even if our genetic code was constantly updated as we laid down new memories during our lives, if an organ was transferred to someone else that person's genome would have to change and incorporate some of the genetic information from the transplanted organ. This does not happen - a person's genome doesn't change after an organ transplant.


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» left by Rocky from Newport (96 days 4 hours ago.)

There have been reports where people that have had transplants of organs, to have dreams, that have relavents of the donnor lives and Dejavu has also been manifested when meeting donnors relations or visiting the location of where the donnor had come from

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» left by Leah ^(12,697)
Leah (1 year 209 days ago.)
So if you accept behavioural traits can be herditary how do you suggest that transfer of hereditry traits takes place if not via the genes? Meanwhile science is not up to speed on all things genetic or memory so it impossible to use the word 'evidence' or lack thereof.

Meanwhile, for me the 'evidence' that memories from life are stored in our genetic code is evolution. Natural selection is inadequate in explaining all cases of diversity, that's my opinion.

There are increasingly more things coming out re memory and genes and fractals. Google 'the language of fractals' and you may be surprised what you find. I know I was. I haven't included all the links in the article that support my little hypothesis but there are more. I find it all very fascinating. Thanks for the feedback.
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» left by Leah ^(12,697)
Leah (1 year 209 days ago.)

I just Googled and found this:

"Fractal Imaging Gives Robots a Body Language
You easily know when a friend or a colleague is happy or not. Why? Because of our human senses. But what about guessing if an autonomous machine, such as a robot, is pouting because it expects new instructions, or is happily crunching data? In "Fractals show machine intentions," Technology Research News tells us that "researchers from Switzerland and South Africa have designed a visual interface that would give autonomous machines the equivalent of body language."

This interface consists of a clustered algorithm which regroups the myriads of internal states of a machine into a small number, and a fractal generator. By looking at these changing fractal images, you start to 'feel' the machine's 'thoughts.' The first practical applications should appear within five years, while self-evolving or self-repairing robots will not come before a long time, according to the researchers."

http://radio.weblogs.com/0105910/2004/06/23.html

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» left by Dave from Kent, UK (285 days 17 hours ago.)

I was just sitting watching TV and something came to mind about memories and I suddenly saw them structured, connected like a fractal. It seemed to make sense so I googled "fractal memories" and got here and the Chaos96 site. I wasn't thinking of genes, but I guess I arrived at this subject in somewhat the same way as you!

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» left by creativeblogger (285 days 10 hours ago.)

That's great Dave, let's hope scientists catch up soon!
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» left by Anonymous (121 days 21 hours ago.)

Are you suggesting that we pass on memories to the next generation through our genes? because if that is the case most of those memories would not be passed on owing to the fact that most of us reproduce in our comparitive youth!

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» left by creativeblogger leah (119 days 23 hours ago.)

good point - the memories would relate to environmental experience which perhaps changes very little in a single lifetime.

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» left by Rocky from Newport (96 days 4 hours ago.)

I also share this thought..... and if you look at recent time lines you will see a great example of this - take the UK with its increasing teen pregnacies.

The younger people reproduce the less experience memory transfers resulting in their young leading into a more troubled life. This may sound like a sterotype but could also result to be factual.

Maybe the more memories you have of your own to transfer the less of other generations gets transfered??? it would be an interesting experiment.

 

deja vu: been there before? or have relations been there?

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» left by Leah ^(12,697)
Leah (31 days 18 hours ago.)

Great feedback here everyone, I'm going to have to ponder all this some more. I think there might be new stuff re this on the Internet now too, so I shall have a Google and pop back!

 

Thanks

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